The Secret Cult

Discussion of the SES, particularly in the UK.
Antises

Postby Antises » Sun Aug 15, 2004 2:29 pm

I totally agree with TB. Discredit the SES where discredit is due. Attempting to criticize the SES, as some have done, by calling it a cult with all the wickedness it implies to so many, is pointless. In this respect, the title "The Secret Cult" is the greatest turn-off.

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Postby mgormez » Mon Aug 16, 2004 4:20 am

Antises wrote:In this respect, the title "The Secret Cult" is the greatest turn-off.


That funny because the title is what catched my eye browsing second hand books in a large bookshop in the busy Kalverstraat in Amsterdam. If I hadn't bought that book then, I wouldn't have made the website and this forum wouldn't be.

As we say in Holland, every disadvantage has its advantage :wink:
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Postby Goblinboy » Tue Aug 17, 2004 12:39 pm

a different guest wrote:Do you think the process of sidestreaming "unsuitable" members still happens? I mean Bella certainly had a mind of her own and stikes me as just the sort of person they might do this to.



Different Guest – (sorry about the delay – significant life event took me away) I certainly suspected that Bella was probably in a side stream. However, as she has been silent for some time, she may have been brought to heel by her SOP tutor, as she would have doubtless discussed her participation on this board with him/her, and may be drawn into the inner stream. Pity.

Her views are not unlike a tiny minority of SOP people I have known, who were long serving SOP members, but didn’t seem to fit the wan, exhausted and Calvanistic SOP stereotype of their peers.

It’s the harsh treatment of children that still leaves me gutted. Particularly when the direction comes from the childless. I’m interested to learn more about current SOP practices concerning child rearing and education, as those of twenty years ago would attract criminal charges under current risk frameworks and legistation. Interesting how the “natural laws” concerning the education of children by the School of Philosophy (which are presumably unchanging by definition) have evidently changed.

The inherent racism, obsession with hierarchy and pantomime snobbery is extraordinary – desperately sad and darkly, horribly funny (MacLaren choosing his next incarnation and parents – he’s probably now a pale youth in the St James primary school, or a small patch of arctic moss), the obsessing about the evidently criminal nature of Australians) – it seems childish and idiotic in its breathtaking ignorance and arrogance. If MacLaren was the voice of the Absolute (roughly translates as the SES’s version of God – you can argue the finer points if you will) in this world, the Absolute harbours some very banal, bourgeois views. Not what you’d expect of a deity. Even St Paul on his bad days didn’t come out with jingoistic nonsense like that.

Interesting to think that these people are probably still alive and kicking. I’d heard Mavro had come to the attention of the police, and left / was kicked out of the SOP (presumably after publication of “Secret Cult”) but continues his Ouspenskiite nonsense in some secrecy these days (I don’t think Ouspenski wouldn’t mind me calling in nonsense – it’s a less caustic term than he used himself about his work in retrospect – a fact that the SES / SOP doesn’t seem to have explored – presumably because it’s an effective way of manipulating people).
Last edited by Goblinboy on Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby a different guest » Wed Aug 18, 2004 6:36 am

You have me wondering about the SOP's current beleifs in child rearing.
Last edited by a different guest on Fri Feb 18, 2005 12:04 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby Goblinboy » Thu Aug 19, 2004 3:28 am

Check messages DG.

westie

Sydney SOP 1970 - 2004

Postby westie » Sat Aug 21, 2004 5:19 am

Hi Goblinboy .... interesting stuff that you have observed. Here are a few more details. MAVRO ... not his full name, hence difficult to track him down. Lives in Neutral Bay. The NSW Police have indeed looked into the school several times when he ran it. Mainly due to the 'shock' of the meditation initiation, some of the women simply flipped ! But that was way back in the 70's. He was indeed 'run out' of the school by other senior members ( particularly the head of the Melbourne school, who knew at first hand some of Mavro's female pecadillos -- Ms. Petts for example )
Current head is A. Renshaw a teacher at a prestigious Sydney school . Everyone has 'skeletons in the cupboard' ... as does he. Great getogethers with copious wine drinking make up the bulk of social activities to which no non-sop people are ever invited.
As to the record of events as described by A.Ravesi in 'Secret Cult' all too true, I'm afraid. Even sadder is the criminal fate of Ravesi's son, a footballer in Adelaide -- and one of the first of the children put under the Sydney SOP's 'care' during the mid 70's.
Nowdays the world-wide circle of 'schools' is cashed up and in desperate need of new pupils. Millions of pounds were donated to fund a book publishing venture under the name of 'The Reneisance Foundation'. Many of the senior members have eagerly lined their pockets in the pursuit of publishing "fine books' for the community which now sit in wharehouses -- unread and unsold. Still the money rolls in.
Finally --- where or where are the rest of Australia's disatisfied ex schoolies, I wonder. This is a truism : MOST people who participated in the Scool over the last 35 years have left -- and though many would like to talk about their experiences -- most don't know that any forum exists. I was tipped off about this site by a collegue who thought that it might be of interest. It was.

whistleblower

The school is back!

Postby whistleblower » Sun Aug 22, 2004 12:58 am

Ladies and Gentlemen,

For those of you who thought that Mavros reign was over, please allow me to 'enlighten' you. He is the head of another school established almost immediately after his leaving SOP. This school is called the School of self knowledge.

NOTHING HAS CHANGED.

The book reads as though it was written yesterday about this school. Mr Maclaren's soul has now re-encarnated into the body of Mr Mavro- even the facial features...bizaare.

The school website is www.schoolforselfknowledge.org

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Postby a different guest » Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:34 am

Jeesh - the website reads almost word for word the same as the SOP's ads in the newspapers.
Last edited by a different guest on Fri Feb 18, 2005 12:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

westie

parenting course

Postby westie » Sun Aug 22, 2004 6:04 am

a different guest wrote:Jeesh - the website reads almost word for word the same as the SOP's ads in the newspapers.

PS to Westie - if you're in Sydney how about attending the parenting course and reporting back? :)
http://www.philosophy.net.au/site/cours ... y&course=3




Do you know the expression 'One Trick Pony' ? ( with apologies to Mr. Simon ) That is Mavro . When he was pushed out some of his most faithful cronies ( those most 'intelectually challenged ) went with him . For what it's worth it was a phone call from MacLaren, in NZ at the time, that finally forced him to go -- the scandals had become too large to sweep under the carpet . Many of the senior members of the era slowly drifted off after Michael M. moved on . Nearly all who had young children at that time ie who were bring them up under the Schools 'guidence' paid a bitter price in later years with very unhappy results as the children grew older.
Mavro goes to great lenghts to keep his whereabouts private and is much out of the public eye -- he is an old man after all.
Today the Sydney SOP keeps a low and wary profile -- I'm sure that no one there now would like to return to anything like the 'old regime' -- especially the remaining senior members -- too much money at stake.

As to the parenting course , sorry but can't do . It is probably harmless -- no one is going to risk upsetting the apple cart -- again, there is too much money at stake especially for the most snior members -- their moto : No Publicity Please .... but they still need new uninformed members.

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Postby a different guest » Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:04 am

You think the parenting course is a way of recruiting new members?

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Re: Sydney SOP 1970 - 2004

Postby Goblinboy » Tue Aug 24, 2004 2:15 am

Thanks for these insights Westie and Whistleblower. I'd heard that Mavro was still doing the same schtick under a different shingle. I guess he finds new people to bully.

Interesting that MacLaren pushed him out, along with John Jepsen of the Melbourne School (once a Human Resources Manager with IBM where graduate recruits described him in uncharitable terms, now living in the luxurious surrounds of Iloura in St Kilda, wholly supported and "attended to" by the School of Philosphy).

westie wrote:MAVRO ... not his full name, hence difficult to track him down. Lives in Neutral Bay. The NSW Police have indeed looked into the school several times when he ran it.


However, sites like this and search engines make it increasingly difficult to hide. A relatively rare name is a gift to Googlers.

I'd be interested to hear more about the time of Mavro, Westie (and others), if you can make the time to reminisce. Just how was he "run out" and how did the School of Philosphy in Sydney manage the damage?

And what happended to Ravesi's son?
Last edited by Goblinboy on Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

westie

Re: Sydney SOP 1970 - 2004

Postby westie » Tue Aug 24, 2004 10:02 am

[quote="Goblinboy"]Thanks for these insights Westie and Whistleblower. I'd heard that Mavro was still doing the same schtick under a different shingle. I guess he finds new people to bully.

Interesting that MacLaren pushed him out, along with John Jepsen of the Melbourne School (an odd fish himself - once an Human Resources Manager with IBM where graduate recruits described him in very uncharitable terms, now living in the luxurious surrounds of Iloura in St Kilda, wholly supported and "attended to" by the School of Philosphy).

[quote="westie"]MAVRO ... not his full name, hence difficult to track him down. Lives in Neutral Bay. The NSW Police have indeed looked into the school several times when he ran it.[/quote]

However, sites like this and search engines make it increasingly difficult to hide. A relatively rare name is a gift to Googlers.

I'd be interested to hear more about the time of Mavro, Westie (and others), if you can make the time to reminisce. Just how was he "run out" and how did the School of Philosphy in Sydney manage the damage?

And what happended to Ravesi's son?[/quote]


There were several 'issues' that caused him to be removed . In the main, there was a very strong group of senior students who failed to appreciate the sartorial lifestyle that Mr. M had acquired . There was an interview on Sydney's Ch 7 at the time, held outside the then HQ of the SOP in Kent st. They had been tipped off that Mavro was 'in residence' in his third floor suite. One of the school's flunkies was sent down to fob the reporters off. This was the first time that the SOP activities had been shown on a mainstream Current Affairs prog. Some of the senior members were fearful that more of this public exposure was to come -- hence they passed on information to London and MacL -- who had his own 'publicity problems' at the time .
There was another reason -- far less known within the Sydney school. Mavro had for some years an ongoing extramarital affair with one of the senior female students . One would have had to have known Mavro at the time and been under his influence ( any of the 'Top three groups' ) to appreciate the enormous power that he wielded -- he simply intimidated everybody. Although some had begun to suspect his relationship with Ms P. none dared to mention anything to his wife -- the second most powerful person there. This whilst giving searing 'sexual morality' lectures to his senior men's and women's groups -- all seperate and segregated . A case of do as I say but not as I do ... not surprising really is it ? When Mrs. M found out, the woman concerned was hustled , within the week, off back to her former home in England.
One has to remember that all the senior people including the Mavro's were, in ordinary life --- well, simply ordinary. What they had created was a small but intense 'kingdom' in which they were 'people of consequence'. To gain the coveted position of tutor meant doing exactly as you were ordered to by the Mavro's -- if not you were first 'streamed' into a 'waffle group' and largley ostricised by your peers ... and then , usually after one had paid the next terms fees, one simply 'vanished' ie left. The rule was that no school person could meet with or speak to anyone who had left . Imagine the pain that caused family members some of who stayed in. Imagine what that did to people who had been in for ten years or so, made friends and then found that no one would talk to them.
The whole thing really was a mangled attempt at running a School of the Fourth Way. Although, in my opinion, it helped some to find new and substantial meaning in their lives, to many many others it simply caused a lot of pain.
I'm fairly certain that none of this sort of stuff goes on in there any more, everyone concerned is far too cautious of the legal ramifications nowadays and besides, as I have mentioned previously --- there is far too much money at risk. Those senior members in Sydney and Melbourne, for example need their well earned ( in their view) and comfortable retirement .
One could ask, for example ; what happened to MacLaren's personal female attendant -- she who travelled and tended him for years -- after he passed on . Why was she unceremoniously 'dumped' by the senior London school's 'management' . She is no longer in the school and no one in it is in contact with her Did she know too much, perhaps ? There are people who do but so far none has spoken out.

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Re: Sydney SOP 1970 - 2004

Postby Alban » Tue Aug 24, 2004 3:52 pm

westie wrote:One could ask, for example ; what happened to MacLaren's personal female attendant -- she who travelled and tended him for years -- after he passed on . Why was she unceremoniously 'dumped' by the senior London school's 'management' . She is no longer in the school and no one in it is in contact with her Did she know too much, perhaps ? There are people who do but so far none has spoken out.


Does anyone know any more about this lady? It would certainly be very informative to hear of her experiences.

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Re: Sydney SOP 1970 - 2004

Postby mgormez » Wed Aug 25, 2004 9:16 pm

I can't fathom why the quote-function does work on this particular posting of westie. The code looks alright to me.
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Re: Sydney SOP 1970 - 2004

Postby Goblinboy » Thu Aug 26, 2004 12:46 am

Thanks for the posting Westie.

westie wrote:Mavro had for some years an ongoing extramarital affair with one of the senior female students… This whilst giving searing 'sexual morality' lectures to his senior men's and women's groups -- all seperate and segregated . A case of do as I say but not as I do ... not surprising really is it ? When Mrs. M found out, the woman concerned was hustled , within the week, off back to her former home in England.


As Lord Acton said, “power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely” (shameless pun fully intended). Morality and power are difficult bedfellows.

westie wrote:One has to remember that all the senior people including the Mavro's were, in ordinary life --- well, simply ordinary. What they had created was a small but intense 'kingdom' in which they were 'people of consequence'.


This aligns with my impression of the Melbourne School of Philosophy - “the tiny, interior cuteness of it all” as the poster of the “1982” thread described his experience of the SES on this site. A self-contained world where answers were provided for people who were searching for meaning, people with a yearning for affinity, for somewhere to belong, and who could be gradually cajoled into a willing suspension of disbelief.

westie wrote:One could ask, for example ; what happened to MacLaren's personal female attendant -- she who travelled and tended him for years -- after he passed on . Why was she unceremoniously 'dumped' by the senior London school's 'management' . She is no longer in the school and no one in it is in contact with her Did she know too much, perhaps ? There are people who do but so far none has spoken out.


OK, I’m asking. That she was booted out implies that she was involved in something the School found unsavoury. From a management perspective, dumping is a very poor way of minimising risk to the School’s reputation – just as the edicts about no contact with members who have left created more opponents than friends.

Can you shed any more light on her situation, Westie?


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