"No sexual abuse in SES/SOP?"

Discussion of the SES, particularly in the UK.
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Postby a different guest » Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:03 am

Get your own back ST James boys as this is on the same level as the provocation by ADG


Get thee to a website that explains net etiquette Ross. You are now guilty of INCITING flaming.

As to the rest of your post - well I think the fact you mistook the Murdoch press for a "quality broadsheet" says it all. (where is that ROFL smilie?)

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pedantry

Postby ross nolan » Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:19 am

Intelligent readers will appreciate the difference between a sensationalist British type tabloid (eg "Tony Blair long lost brother of Elvis" sort of rubbish "Pedophile females" could well have been a spoof title hence the proof -- I had already cut the article out , typeface is the same.

I think the Australian has the largest circulation and is a national paper - you decide if it has no credibility. It is 'politically correct' to slander Rupert Murdoch and flippant but could mislead foreign readers.

Typical ADG "defence" -more trivia -- I am inciting you being treated with the same lack of seriousness as you just displayed.

I do not know that you do not molest your children ADG -- is that why you seek to discredit that article ? (some more of your own back )


The PM to Free Thinker - date Wed Mar 08 2006 (as promised)

Dear FT, thanks for the support on the 'democracy' thread -- you temper this with "I have quite a few issues with Ross..." If you wouldn't mind I would like to refresh my memory on what I might have said that you disagree with . I have just been reviewing some of the older threads (before I was aware of the forum in many cases) and I have become a bit more aware of some of the really traumatic postings re the girls school and others and came across a number of your postings that I found very sincere and moving.

I do not like to cause offence but I have been forced to fight myself over a damn lot of years with various bureacracies,corrupt police and worse and even with trying to get these bastards brought to book I have become enbroiled in some sort of cover up and hate campaign with the local council even (you might recall they put the school of philosophy up gratis or else as I suspect some palm greasing is going on with councillors ) - I have been beaten up, jailed (over Christmas because of refusing to back down on a matter of principle), lost my business etc etc
whilst tackling a corrupt aviation bureacracy and giving help to three widows whose husbands got killed in unsafe and illegally approved aircraft that I had issued grounding notices on . (all interstate,never even met them and only seen on TV 'curent affairs' as part of reporting of my case and efforts to reform that body) Anyway I know a bit about mistreatment and had enough exposure to the Jehovah's Witnesses cult and my brother's other cult involvement ( deleted this for privacy reasons) to understand the effects of things like the SES.

I have locked horns with ADG at times and I admit she does get under my skin -- I think she often treats this thing like a triviality and anyone from the school trying to discredit this forum would likely quote some of her stuff about "sucking Tim Tams etc" - that should be kept in mind.

Again I cannot go mute when palpably wrong statements about aboriginal culture or something related to that are made and even without sweeping and insulting generalizations about "all country folk are hicks" are. made .

I can guess you might have decided I am misogynist or something from my disagreeable disagreement s with ADG -- she posted a whole swag of PM's that I answered as helpfully as I could long before she ever "flamed"
me so there might be more to the story than you deduce.

Anyway I would like to clear up (or maybe confirm your worst about me) whatever "issues" you have -- I can assure you I will not be abusive or anything other than genuinely interested to know how I have given offence and if I can agree then to apologize.

Not a big deal really but if you like I would appreciate being able to clear up any disputes.

With regards,

Ross Nolan.

end quote - that was the "offending" PM to FT -- I have just gotten her "response" after reading all my last posting and I am quite frankly disgusted.

Something about "jazz" and being 'racist',' sexist' etc and beneath any capability of understanding her vastly superior worth in effect -- I guess I am just another 'male chauvanist pig' and not even worth the effort.

I cannot help but feel the SES indoctrination has gotten through though .

Nothing I could say would not be wasted so I will not .

It is probably a vain hope that people on this site could act in concert to oppose the SES's worst aspects and to help rather than hinder but the fact of human nature seems to preclude that . If you found my PM somehow shameful or worthy of contemptuous dismissal maybe you could say why (or why not if so ) .....

Enough said -- let's get back on to useful postings.
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Re: pedantry

Postby a different guest » Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:34 am

ross nolan wrote:I do not know that you do not molest your children ADG -- is that why you seek to discredit that article ? (some more of your own back )

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pedantry or what ?

Postby ross nolan » Thu Mar 09, 2006 11:27 am

Your point Dame Edna?

Or just after the last word again ?

If you think this "Proves" that you could not molest your children just BECAUSE you are female you make my point marvelously -- what a double standard of hypocricy .

Anyone with real interest might look up the tragic case of the unjust imprisonment of Louise Mc Phee presently in jail for allegedly killing her own baby as she has been for seven years - story was covered by Radio National recently .
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Postby a different guest » Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:08 pm

accusing parents of molesting their children?

Quoting PM's and naming who wrote them?

Tell me Ross, which female on this board HAVEN'T you pissed off?

Meanwhile if there is a male equivalent of "bored housewife" I think you would fit the criteria - by the length and tediousness of your posts you have FAR too much time on your hands.

Don't you have a spyware problem to deal with?

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back on topic

Postby ross nolan » Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:55 pm

To GENUINE readers,

Official statistics confirm that the vast majority of sexual (and other) abuse of children occurrs WITHIN families -- not an accusation but a sad fact. We even have a word for it - INCEST.

Numerous cases of women injuring their children to get into hospital so that THEY (the mothers) get attention are recorded - so frequent in fact that it too ,gets a name-- "Von Munchausen's by proxy" -- the tragic cases of SIDS (sudden infant death syndome) due to mothers smothering their children to death (recorded by surveillance camera ) as a result of post natal depression or other mental problems are also not unknown (except to you it appears) a number of prosecutions for infanticide by mothers are currently in train and reported by mainstream media -- it is unusual for men to engage in this activity in fact.

Haven't heard about the sexual predation by female teachers of their young male students either? -- several high profile cases reported including jailing of several female teachers,pregnancies and even oddball marriages (mismatch ages,support etc in jail ceremonies ...) look up the case of ex Senator Cheryl Kernot (Australian democrats - had an affair with a young male student when a teacher ) "Feminist" Bettina Arndt has written of her being sexually fondled by an uncle when she was a child but,said she didn't find it traumatic and thought a lot of girls probably had the same experience (the Australian -- should be able to locate her article) -- that's from a woman. Likewise Germaine Greer with her "homage' to the young male nude ---- healthy or what ?

I could go on but I think ADG's feigned ignorance and hope to be "bolstered" in her righteous indignation might be a bit false sounding...

Or ,maybe you agree with Queen Victoria ?

Female teachers (prison guards, soldiers, etc etc ) ARE quite capable of sexual misconduct -- ex girls school pupils are not lying ADG.

Please see the last posting to the "democracy ...or is it?" thread for another view with factual example .

The "Sydney" thread details really nasty sexual harassment /abuse within an SES family environment .

I think that you (Dame Edna) and your chatting buddy FT are the sum of it -- the facts about female underrepresentation in most of the dirty,manual, industrial occupations were not to your liking but are facts (I think I recall someone,possibly Bella, coming in to say, amidst your usual welter of 'righteous indignation without proof', well..... yes ..he's right about that .... etc etc also the preponderance of male composers etc etc --that is just how things are ( do you force your boys to play with dolls or girls to play bulldozer driver just to satisfy your prejudices ? -recall your little diatribe on that one ?)

You seem to want to "side" with someone all the time ADG - perhaps because you have no ideas of your own or any real connection to the subject (except your expressed concern over that inheritance -- hope they don't reincarnate too quickly and come back for it !)

Maybe you cannot stand on your own and carry a coherent argument in your own case -- we don't know since you concentrate on flippant little posts that add nothing but seek to ingratiate quite frequently .

I don't waste time watching neighbours and type quite fast so don't worry about my use of time -- I have a real objective as well .

The only PM I quoted was my own . You are what is called a "leech" in netspeak ADG - all take and no give and always 'popping in' to let everyone know how important you are -- quick and dirty Using insulting terms like "troll" etc is no substitute for a little of substance.

Again, GENUINE readers of this thread with issues of sexual misconduct;-

Please ignore the innuendo by ADG and do take action about REAL sexual abuse -- ESPECIALLY if by your parents - they have no RIGHT to do anything that is improper just because they are parents or older.

Take advantage of the organizations like Broken Rites or the "kids helpline" (in Australia) - don't put up with it or stay in fear.
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Re: something to think about

Postby leon » Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:00 pm

ross nolan wrote:
From personal experience I can vouch for the desensitizing effect of authority on women

Download here)


Thats a truly incredible statement.

ps,
(I think you will find many SES tutors that will concur with you.)

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Postby mgormez » Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:15 pm

Ross, kindly but urgently see your PM box.
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Postby xstJ » Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:22 pm

Ross,

While I appreciate you starting this important thread and providing very useful links I am baffled by your abuse aimed at ADG and Free Thinker and by your rants about female abusers. You seem to be on a crusade to prove that women can be abusers too, when, as far as I can see, no-one's disagreeing with you on that.

What people are rightly taking issue with is your suggestion that women in authority become 'desensitised' and you imply are therefore capable of abuse. This is straightforward sexism which, as Leon pointed out, fits SES philosophy exactly.

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Postby Free Thinker » Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:02 am

Nope, no one is disagreeing that women can be abusers, too. You need to get the idea out of your head that I don't agree with you or that I am defending female abusers, etc.

Here is a perrfect example of sexism:

"How equal to you really want to be ? (I think my long ago comment that there is no female Mozart to point to or lots of other areas of male "domination" like coal mines,foundrys, slaughterhouses or the vast majority of industrial jobs that women are not fighting their way into.

Perhaps you could accept the truth of that statement and get over it -- I can accept that I cannot make babies . "

Yes, you CANNOT make babies. But I CAN work in a coal mine, foundry, or a slaughterhouse if I want to, and there ARE female musical geniuses. So your comparison holds no merit.

You are telling me to accept that I cannot work in those areas or that there aren't women Mozarts. That is sexism. Just because a group of people aren't fighting its way into a horrible, degrading, oppressing job that has a horrible OSHA (Occupation Safety and Handling Association) record doesn't mean that it couldn't if it wanted to.

Right now slaughterhouse jobs have the highest death and accident rate in the US of all occupations and those holding jobs there are mostly immigrants and the VERY poorest of the poor. It is also the occupation with the highest job turnaround. No one wants to do it.

So the fact that women aren't fighting to work in slaughterhouses doesn't mean that women aren't capable of it, or that they aren't fighting to do other things they want to.

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Postby mgormez » Fri Mar 10, 2006 2:04 am

Back to the original topic.
Mike Gormez

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Postby Free Thinker » Fri Mar 10, 2006 3:38 am

Gladly Mike - it is a shame that the abuse that occurred in the Girl's schools is not being investigated with the same sincerity and depth that is done for the boys. For while the boys certainly endured more physical abuse, the emotional abuse the girls endured can be far more wide-reaching in terms of effects on their lives. Not to make in any way light of what happened to the boys.

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update

Postby ross nolan » Fri Mar 10, 2006 8:10 am

Dear All, this is to wind up my involvement with this thread (voluntarily I might add ) I have deleted parts of earlier posts that were nothing to be proud of and I have apologized to ADG for offence taken (any inexplicable references in left over text might have referred to that )

For my part I deny completely any warranted association or comparison to the 'blackshirts' and stand by all my statements of fact -- the blackshirts insult has no applicability at all --- I have never been married or de facto, have had no court or intervention orders of any kind ever, have no interest in that association or it's aims etc -

The woman I helped get support I have had no relationship of any kind ,contacted and helped entirely by phone and only once ever saw her when she came to my place (with kids and new man ) to say thanks .

Likewise for any other of the females mentioned. Apart from the specific instances of the council personnel (both female ) involved in keeping the school of philosophy in housing-

I have good relations with both my female neighbours and others around . I totally refute any innuendo cast against me in that post (not retracted when appropriate or since )

Leon asked about my statement about the desensitizing effect of authority on women -- my point is that women are not immune from the corrupting effect of authority or poweer - same as men are , If I am a "damned misogynist" for saying that how do YOU explain the horrendous sexual and physical abuse of male Iraqi prisoners in the, female commanded , Abu Ghraib prison carried out by both men and women ? I put it down to power (authority is another term for the same thing ) -- the corrosive effect of titles,uniforms and rules plus a control situation has been well proven by the "blue eyes - brown eyes" experiment where children are told that blue eyed people are stupid and have to be controlled by the smart brown eyed ones -- usually takes only a few hours until physical abuse and submissive behaviour arises - likewise the "stanford experiment' with a mock jail and undergraduates acting as guards or prisoners -- gets out of control in only days,

I see the "kiss my hand" incident as a clear example of power being used abusively and in a megalomaniacal fashion by a female teacher (as in the girls school testimomy )

It is not being misogynist to note that women are not agitating for equal representation in dirty and unpleasant jobs -- "equality" means 'equality' not just in the clean 'plum' office jobs so this term is shown to be false -- don't worry though men have broad shoulders and don't begrudge doing the' heavy lifting' work of society.

Ross.
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Re: update

Postby a different guest » Fri Mar 10, 2006 8:58 am

ross nolan wrote: I have apologized to ADG


He has?

*looks around*

where?

Or was that it?

ross nolan
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feigned ignorance

Postby ross nolan » Sat Mar 18, 2006 11:44 pm

Postscript correction -- I DID delete the 'offending' statement suggesting finding a name (those who first read the thread would know this to be true ) and apologized for letting myself be goaded to doing it and for any genuine ,not feigned, offence. (see above)

ADG had conceded nothing about 'blackshirts' etc or undertaking not to continually interject with pedantic piffle. There has been private messaging via the -off forum- "sandbox" set up by Mike (apparently unknown to some readers ) and I came to the conclusion that nothing I could say or facts would have any effect on the prejudices expressed.

The final straw was being told that supporting a girl, screwed up by scientologists (amongst others) who was then sexually abused by a psychiatrist -known to me from a completely unrelated avenue- was another example of my misogyny.

I will post any factual material that defends my position on Aboriginal issues or otherwise related to Australia in the 'general issues' off bulletin board thread originally set up by Mike.

In anticipation of the 'got to be right' ' have the last word' compulsion, regardless of truth, by my 'Nemesis' I will just post an "ouch" (indicating a slap in the face or 'double ouch' for a kick in the balls ) to show that I have read the post but not respond .

Thanks, Ross.
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