SES Forums

SES PHILOSOPHY: what it’s like and what to watch out for...

I have prepared some notes concerning philosophy in the SES which indicate what it is like as well as pointing out some things to watch out for, obviously from my own experience as a woman in the London school from 1990 – 2009. The notes are about 9,000 words long, so I do not intend to put them up on the forum, but if anyone is interested please make a note below (or send me a private message) and I will send them to you.

If anyone has any comments on the notes I would be very interested to see them, and please do put them below.

Stiltrubld

stiltrubld wrote:The notes are about 9,000 words long, so I do not intend to put them up on the forum

Please don't let that stop you posting your notes on the forum - you can break them up into several posts if you want.

Daffy
ses-forums.org administrator

Thanks Daffy, but I would rather just give them out to really interested parties. I don’t think they are necessary in general. And I don’t want them left open for ever as it were. Unless you don’t want the forum used in this way? In which case I’ll have to think a bit more about what I put up.

When I first contributed to this site I thought I knew things about the SES that others may not. But it has slowly dawned on me that many of the people here, and in particular those of you that had parents in the SES and went to the linked schools, really get it deep down. I have learned a lot from you all, and much more than I already realised. Anyone is welcome to these notes, but you will probably just find them boring, those of you that already know more than me about it all.

Stiltrubld

Please send me the notes, or start a new thread with the notes. I think you're underestimating the level of interest in your work!

I'm definitely interested too.

Bonsai

xxx

Yes stiltrubld, you are definitely underestimating the interest in your work, I would appreciate if you could send them to me too. I have not been out of SOP for very long and sometimes find myself doubting what made me leave and if I am exaggerating what I saw and how I felt. I seem to swing backwards and forwards - but I know that's what happens sometimes with these things. This site is so helpful to me to reaffirm what I already know - and not let the brainwashing and doubts take over. Thank you for this opportunity - I know it will help many people, myself included.

<delete>

Thanks Free for Jimmy. There was something on the TV this morning about 'honor killing' - murdering a member of their own family, usually women. Its quite amazing what people believe in.

Carlynn wrote:

I have not been out of SOP for very long and sometimes find myself doubting what made me leave and if I am exaggerating what I saw and how I felt. I seem to swing backwards and forwards - but I know that's what happens sometimes with these things.

I know I have now sent you the notes so you will know how I understood things. But I just want to add that I still doubt myself too! In fact one of the things that the book Free pointed me to 'The Guru Papers' mentions is that an aspect of authoritarian power is causing self-doubt, in order to gain control. The authors do not mean to suggest that all kinds of heirarchy are bad, but that there are types that are particularly authoritarian in human organisations/societies and they suggest this is an outdated model that can be very harmful and that humanity needs to move on from that. If I have understood them correctly.

Also I think 'doubt' is OK, but watch out for certainty - can lead to fundamentalism!

I had to be pulled out of there in the end, by the help of a kind soul here, and all I would say is that I am sure you have made the right decision in leaving, especially because you could see what was going on. It washes over some people so they may not be hurt. But anyone who begins to see it, don't put yourself through it.

I was talking to a friend about it, as I still thought of the SES as a 'spiritual' organisation. But my friend keeps telling me that is the wrong assumption. He illustrated it with this comment: "what other spiritual organisations do you know of where they punch children in the face?"

Tears run down. xxx - to Neil.

Love, Stiltrubld

Carlynn wrote under another topic - 'Clara Salaman / Live in the present':

I noted the times when I did not conform to the set out rules I was punished by being given excessive or mundane tasks, when I appeared to conform things softened. I did this a few times so that I could observe what was happening - and that it was not my overtired mind.

This is classic use of 'reward and punishment' - used a lot in the SES in my experience. Also someone described it like this to me once: "it's a mixture of sentimentality and cruelty".

I have found a quote from the book mentioned in the above post - The Guru Papers - Masks of Authoritarian Power. It may help explain the problem of authoritarian power and control over others, and demands/expectations of 'conformity'.

"Epilogue: Where to go from here?

Behind the masks of authoritarian power is the idea that there is some greater intelligence that knows what is best for others. What this always amounts to is that someone either claims to have that intelligence, or to have a direct line into properly interpreting it. This can occur in any realm and in differing degrees. Its most extreme forms occur when moral superiority is linked to infallibility. The image of the guru represents the epitome of this construction, which is the reason for this book’s title. Often included in this is the corollary that the authority cares more about your well-being than you do, and can do so because of being selfless. Whether or not a state of ultimate selflessness or infallibility is achievable by anyone can be debated. Then too, there is the question of how anyone could be certain someone else really is in such a state. What is clear, however, is that obeying others because they claim to be morally superior, or to have an inside track to truth, not only breeds corruption and lies, but removes people from personal responsibility. ....

For us, hope lies in the possibility of moving beyond our authoritarian past in order to build together a future that values keeping this planet habitable for its interwoven and interdependent forms of life. If the challenge is met, the world will have to be a better place for those living in it, because for the first time since the early small bands of humanity’s infancy, everyone’s well-being is once again linked with survival."

This is just to say that I am withdrawing my notes, and would be grateful if those of you who have so far received them could ensure that they do NOT find their way into the hands of anyone in the SES.

Many thanks.

Bluemoon (previously stiltrubld)

May you remain absolutely safe and respected as an honest, truthful person. That is true.



And why does the smile not appear "real"?

Bluemoon

Stay true and honest. That's all you've ever been. The SES wants you to question everything: yourself, what you do, the universe, etc but it doesn't like it when you question the SES or the motives of the SES.

Bonsai

<delete>

Thanks morrigan, bonsai and free.

Free that has really helped to understand it.

I guess I panicked a bit yesterday, because I was insulted to start with and because I felt 'threatened' by the lawyers!

I will leave my notes to one side for the time being. But if I have 'defamed' anything, it is only the silverware at Waterperry!

Bluemoon (stiltrubld)