Coming to terms with stupidity

Discussion of the SES' satellite schools in Australia and New Zealand.
User avatar
Cousin It
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 10:28 am
Location: Australia

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Cousin It » Thu Sep 17, 2009 10:08 pm

Witness wrote:Firstly, the sense of "stupidity" can cause disenchanted cult members to go through very serious denial - they think they'll lose face if they leave the cult, they are terrified of their pride taking a knock. So they sit it out, lying to themselves and everybody else that they really believe in the teachings.

I know exactly what you mean. I stayed on about 3 years too long. I no longer believed what the school believed, no longer believed in the rituals, the aims, the fawning over the deities. But, the thing that finally forced me out was tutoring. I had all these bright, hopeful people sitting in front of me and I was feeding them a pile of BS. I felt guilty for leading them up the garden path.

Witness wrote:However, many join because they think something is missing from their lives, they are searching for something and are in some sense lost: I believe this is a form of low self-esteem or inferiority complex that is as damaging as egomania.

I'm not sure that I ever suffered from low self esteem but certainly I was searching. I had discovered that materialism wasn't that good so was open to something else. When you come into the school you get the sense that the people there really know something. Unfortunately as you rise through the echelons you find that they don't until you get to meet those at the top up close. What a disappointment! The emperors' new suit!

Witness wrote:The ego trip that people get from being in a spiritual group works especially well on people who have low self-esteem - suddenly they are special, thanks to XYZ initiation rituals and the privileged secrets and promises about enlightenment they are given.

I well remember the dinners on the Saturday night of the residentials with the after dinner speeches. The feeling of being smug and superior because of our access to "the teaching" and the "golden tradition".

Witness wrote:Its important not to not to beat yourself up about being "stupid".

Quite right. I'm just working through feelings of guilt (for time wasted and missing so many family things), frustration (at being used) and annoyance (at being sucked in by a bunch of nonsense). I'm finding it very good to talk about it though.

Witness wrote:I wish you the very best of luck - and please read those books I've recommended.

Thanks. Will do.
Cheers,
Cousin

Free
Posts: 127
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2005 9:30 pm

Postby Free » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:14 am

<delete>
Last edited by Free on Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.

sweetiepie
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 1:16 pm

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby sweetiepie » Fri Sep 18, 2009 7:00 pm

bluegreen wrote:
It's just like addicts who get into drugs in their teens or 20's suffer arrested development as they never deal with anything life throws at them with increasing maturity.


Thank you for the IT advice, Free and bluegreen!

Definitely very similar to the mental state of an addict. I remember thinking to myself on hearing breaking news stories, 'What will be the official School take on this?'. I would actually put off thinking about my own opinion before I had spoken to someone at School. Talk about dependant.
Witness wrote:
I believe this is a form of low self-esteem or inferiority complex that is as damaging as egomania.

The ego trip that people get from being in a spiritual group works especially well on people who have low self-esteem - suddenly they are special,


This is so accurate. And the low self-esteem can flip easily into egomania. The rush you get from that high of 'being special' is also very addictive. I recognise that it was my own low self-esteem which made me such good fodder! But- importantly - that self-esteem was never raised in School, but has been since I left and began my maturing process for real. Dealing with and surviving situations that life throws at you are what raise it.
Sweetiepie

User avatar
Cousin It
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 10:28 am
Location: Australia

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Cousin It » Fri Sep 18, 2009 9:24 pm

sweetiepie wrote:This is so accurate. And the low self-esteem can flip easily into egomania. The rush you get from that high of 'being special' is also very addictive. I recognise that it was my own low self-esteem which made me such good fodder! But- importantly - that self-esteem was never raised in School, but has been since I left and began my maturing process for real. Dealing with and surviving situations that life throws at you are what raise it.
Sweetiepie

As I became more senior in the school I noticed a smug arrogance that substituted for thought and analysis. "We know what's right and wrong."
Maybe at the start people came in humble but many didn't stay that way. They became smarmy gits. They knew from the teaching or from a senior tutor what was right and so did not need to think about it. I sat in group with a guy for over 5 years and in all that time he never once asked an honest question.
I agree with you sweetiepie - it is so much better to deal with situations without resorting to received wisdom.
Cheers,
Cousin

arcturus
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:02 am

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby arcturus » Sun Oct 04, 2009 4:57 am

Cousin It wrote:
Ahamty2 wrote:Jepsen certainly did not have a halo then.

In what way? I'm very interested!


Someone did mention much earlier in the WATD forum about how JMJ came to run the Melbourne school. It was not Mavro -- who distrusted Jepsen, rather the BigMac that placed him there. But all that was so long ago and at the time most of us believed that we were doing 'holy' work to 'save the planet oops, sorry .. the world'. Jep is a strange fish, very ambitious and he has succeeded in having built an empire which in turn will look after him in his dotage. Back in the 70's he liked women,footy and booze ... all pretty normal. There was a period shortly before he went to Melb during which things were in the balance ... which career to choose ... IBM or possible fame and glory with the SOP. Nina Mavro certainly seemed charmed as did most of the ladies in the Sydney school. He had nothing to do with any of them and kept his private social activities very much private, not an easy thing to do with Danny Opacic looking in over his shoulder.
Someone who knew him back then could feel feel sad for the choice that he made ... in life there really is no such thing as a 'free lunch', and the price that you paid old mate, was high. The Melbourne school really is an anachronism and it is all his doing, they think of themselves as being 'enlightened' but in fact have managed to paint themselves very much into a corner.
Sydney with a more skillful administrator, is probably much more at the cutting edge. No one expected the fallout in London, that took place after the death of the Mac.

User avatar
Cousin It
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 10:28 am
Location: Australia

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Cousin It » Sun Oct 04, 2009 5:37 am

arcturus wrote:Someone did mention much earlier in the WATD forum

What's the WATD forum?
arcturus wrote:But all that was so long ago and at the time most of us believed that we were doing 'holy' work to 'save the planet oops, sorry .. the world'.

Isn't it amazing how they dress totally mundane pointless work up as being important. Painting a door for the umpteenth time was important because it was done with "attention".
arcturus wrote:Jep is a strange fish, very ambitious and he has succeeded in having built an empire which in turn will look after him in his dotage.

But, IMHO, he's paid a pretty severe price. Broken engagement, no family, no children, having to do endless residentials and tutors' meetings, being a vegatarian, constantly pausing, meditating, always being on show. I wouldn't swap with him for $10 million.
arcturus wrote:Danny Opacic looking in over his shoulder.

Who's he? The Sydney KGB?
arcturus wrote:The Melbourne school really is an anachronism and it is all his doing, they think of themselves as being 'enlightened' but in fact have managed to paint themselves very much into a corner.

We behave like middle class english gentlemen out of the 1960s in Melbourne. Total BS. I always assumed we behaved like that to emulate Mac.
arcturus wrote:No one expected the fallout in London, that took place after the death of the Mac.

What fallout? Do tell!!! I never met Mac but I found Lambie to be a total arse.
Cheers,
Cousin

Daffy
Moderator
Posts: 333
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 3:32 am

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Daffy » Sun Oct 04, 2009 12:19 pm

Cousin It wrote:What's the WATD forum?

This is answered here: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=659

Tootsie
Posts: 151
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 1:37 pm

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Tootsie » Sun Oct 04, 2009 1:06 pm

Danny Opacic was Mavro's stand over man in Sydney. Miss a residential and you could expect a knock on the door.

arcturus
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:02 am

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby arcturus » Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:28 am

Tootsie wrote:Danny Opacic was Mavro's stand over man in Sydney. Miss a residential and you could expect a knock on the door.


Aahh ...Tootsie, you remember it so well. I understand that nowadays the old Mr & Mrs M. have their regrets about how they handled it all .... don't we all?

arcturus
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:02 am

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby arcturus » Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:32 am

Daffy wrote:
Cousin It wrote:What's the WATD forum?

This is answered here: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=659


By the way Daffy, much belated thanks for your ongoing work in managing this site.

Ahamty2
Posts: 79
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:03 am

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Ahamty2 » Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:23 am

By the way Daffy, much belated thanks for your ongoing work in managing this site.[/quote]

Hear! Hear! We are all deeply indebted to Daffy for taking on the task of keeping this forum going, especially as a dedicated SES-Forum site. At least we can tell it as it was and as it now is and what goes on behind the squeaky clean facade that the SES and the Schools in other countries present to the public at large.

Being from the orginal so called "top" group , the class of January, 1967, you do remember all too well! A little too late for the M's to have regrets now.

Daffy
Moderator
Posts: 333
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 3:32 am

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Daffy » Fri Oct 09, 2009 3:38 am

No problem!

The forum has just celebrated its first anniversary since relocating to ses-forums.org. Thanks to renewed interest kick-started by Clara Salaman's book, and numerous new members registering over the past few months, traffic on this site has trebled since June.

User avatar
ET
Posts: 194
Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 10:49 am
Location: Gloucestershire
Contact:

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby ET » Sat Oct 10, 2009 3:53 pm

Daffy wrote:The forum has just celebrated its first anniversary since relocating to ses-forums.org. Thanks to renewed interest kick-started by Clara Salaman's book, and numerous new members registering over the past few months, traffic on this site has trebled since June.


That's great news! Let's hope it continues to stop some people getting involved with this damaging organisation and its schools.

Good work, Daffy.
Pupil at St James Girl's School from 1979-1989, from age 4-14. Parents ex-members of SES.

User avatar
Cousin It
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 10:28 am
Location: Australia

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Cousin It » Sat Oct 10, 2009 9:43 pm

Yes, congratulations on a year and may this site prosper and the SES wither.
I have been reading of the trauma so many suffered at the day school. What I don't understand is why there have been no legal cases over this. Why haven't a group of traumatised previous students taken the school to court to get compensation for their suffering?
Cheers,
Cousin

Ahamty2
Posts: 79
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:03 am

Re: Coming to terms with stupidity

Postby Ahamty2 » Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:56 am

May I recommend everyone who has had anything to do with the SES, its affiliates and its educational institutions read Clara Salaman's 'Shame on You'. If you have been in the School anywhere or are still in it, read it.

No, this is not a commercial break and I am not associated with Penguin in any way! It is the best thing since "Secret Cult" and the SES can hide behind it's fictional story line as seen through the eyes of a thirteen year old, but we all know that the description and facts are accurate.

I read it as an adult parent with a daughter the same age as Clara who was born into the SES(London) and like her parents, joined in the sixties. Her description through Caroline Stern of us adults doing the School thing made me laugh at how ridiculous we must have looked but laughter soon turned to tears when the consequences of our behaviour stared nakedly back.

It will stir memories for those with first hand experiences and could be a hard slog for you. For those who are still in the School everywhere and want to stay in it,then it is your choice. This is the story of the organization you now support. You can go into denial and rationalize it, all in the name of truth, but you can't hide from it.

The dreamer(LM) is dead and with him the dream. The Lambie's of the Schools want to keep the dream alive and continuing but you can't live someone else's dream for them. This has been proven time and time again.

There was one statement that Leon Maclaren made that went home for me when he said that:" Everything in creation runs down. And I mean Every Thing!" Now that is the so called Truth.


Return to “The Australian and NZ schools”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests