SFSK Devotee

Discussion of the SES' satellite schools in Australia and New Zealand.
enlightened
Posts: 68
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:38 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby enlightened » Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:31 am

I give up...Im questioning what Im gaining by being sucked into this forum.....I need to move on. This is not the place for me, this is a place for people that have had a different experience of SFSK, actually its more to do with this SOP and people who are obviously paralysed with anger and stuck in a very dark place of pain.

bluegreen
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2009 4:42 pm

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby bluegreen » Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:23 pm

Troll
St James Girls School 1977-1981

Ahamty2
Posts: 79
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:03 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby Ahamty2 » Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:43 pm

enlightened wrote:I give up...Im questioning what Im gaining by being sucked into this forum.....I need to move on. This is not the place for me, this is a place for people that have had a different experience of SFSK, actually its more to do with this SOP and people who are obviously paralysed with anger and stuck in a very dark place of pain.


We are not “people who are obviously paralysed with anger and stuck in a very dark place of pain” far from it. It is a sense of duty that it is right and proper to alert as many people as possible. You can’t hear the message being given to you because you have your fingers in your ears and not wanting to hear anything said against Nina Mavro. Whether you like it or not Michael and Nina Mavro are duplicating their Sydney SOP in the SFSK except they are free from the constraint of having to answer to Mr Leon MacLaren, the head of the SES in London and now Donald Lambie et al, otherwise it is so similar. The material is basically from the SES which they have kept and possibly modified it to suit themselves. They go to a different seat of the Shankaracharya after Shantanand Saraswati retired.

Adolf Hitler believed he had a mission to uplift the world. Heinrich Himmler carried a copy of the Bhagavad Gita with him and quoted from it to Hitler and read Sanskrit as well; he imagined Hitler as Krishna and himself as Arjuna, this is the person who ran the death camps: so you would call him spiritual and following the truth as well, wouldn’t you? The superior race , the Aryans, would lead the world. Everything is relative.

The purpose of this Forum is to warn others of the dangers, pitfalls and traps of so called spiritual organizations such as the SES, SOP and SFSK. “He who hath ears to hear, let him hear.” Mat:11.15

Dr Alan is quite right, Advaita Vedanta is not an intellectual concept and not for everyone. In fact very few people in India understand Vedanta and very few people again follow it and it is from their culture not ours. This was said to me by the very person who advised me to leave the SES/SOP, who was a monastic follower of Vedanta himself.

Middle Way
Posts: 78
Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2012 3:46 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby Middle Way » Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:56 pm

Greetings to everyone, from the Middle East where I am in the middle of a study tour of trauma, grief and loss which this region knows a bit about.

AT and others may be interested in hearing about a session yesterday where a subject was discussed (which is familiar to all psychology students): attachment to significant people and the role this plays in subjective feelings of emotional resilience and well-being.

The point was made that attachment figures don’t necessarily have to be humans, but can include groups. The idea is that if an individual is feeling threatened then they will seek proximity and protection from the attachment figure/group, which is seen as a stronger, wiser supportive force. If the figure/group is seen as being available and supportive, the anxious individual can relax and experience a sense of being loved and comforted, and can then more confidently return to other activities.

The familiar point was also made that cults (sorry, AT I know you don’t like that word) are very intrusive as they strive to act as attachment figures, and “it is possible to see how cults can take over anxious people’s lives with the constant message that ‘you are safe here’, particularly when led by a powerful charismatic figure.”

Attempts to point out unpleasant facts to people who for whatever reason derive strong feelings of safety in such an attachment group will therefore not succeed.

MW

enlightened
Posts: 68
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:38 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby enlightened » Sat Apr 13, 2013 11:07 am

Gee thats funny you mention that Middle way as Im doing a post grad essay on that very topic "Developmental Psychology analysed through the lens of John Bowlby's attachment theory"
It is such powerful stuff, the infant's attachment to its primary caregiver will determine its future relationships, based on whether it was secure or insecure attachment. Mine was the latter and my negative childhood experience of attachment was probably the reason I started the search for meaning, and trying at every turn to find a secure attachment figure.

Middle Way
Posts: 78
Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2012 3:46 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby Middle Way » Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:59 pm

That is quite coincidental. Maybe your studies have mentioned that the attachment figure can be a group, but I don't remember that coming up in mine. Maybe that was a big part of me coming to a group like SFSK.

If relevant, I'll tell you more about what I find here, because I think that we will have a session on attachment theory in relation to post traumatic stress disorder. Eg following a life-threatening traumatic event, the avoidant attachment style comes out in the avoiding symptoms of PTSD, while the anxious style comes out in the hypervigilance set of symptoms.

bluegreen
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2009 4:42 pm

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby bluegreen » Sat Apr 13, 2013 7:04 pm

that's interesting, I have recently done an exam on that subject too and so know a little about it. There was no mention of cults, but it makes sense. In fact it seems like what you are covering in Israel pertains quite considerably to 'enlightened's' experience. i.e. an interrupted or insecure attachment with his/her primary care giver has caused him/her (I do wish I knew the gender of people on here) to seek a replacement in adulthood in the form of a "spiritual" movement.
St James Girls School 1977-1981

Jo-Anne Morgan
Posts: 64
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 11:23 pm

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby Jo-Anne Morgan » Sat Apr 13, 2013 9:39 pm

enlightened wrote:and trying at every turn to find a secure attachment figure


Well any illusion that Nina Mavro et al will fulfil that role should be knocked on the head pronto. Unconditional love it ain't.

enlightened
Posts: 68
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:38 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby enlightened » Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:50 pm

Further to my last post, research has led me to John Bradshaw who believes that individuals who had an authoritarian parent/parents are brought up to believe that an an authority figure will always know better than them, they lose their independence and have low self esteem and need approval from an authority figure. These types of individuals will be drawn to groups, orginisations etc, which are regimented, controlling and highly disciplined.

Sydneysider
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:47 pm

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby Sydneysider » Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:33 pm

Hello everyone, I am new to this forum and am someone who has spent more than half of my life involved with the SFSK in Sydney. I am finding that this forum is very helpful on a number of levels. I very much value the opinions of everyone on here, as I continue to live a clearer, happier and more fulfilled life outside of the 'school' walls. It has taken much effort, courage and self-belief to become mentally 'free' from the entire experience, which I will say has had a major impact on my life. I have been reading posts from some great thinkers on this forum, namely MOTS, Dr Alan, Ella MC etc and their posts have particularly helped me wade through many doubts and questions. As has been the experience of other members on this forum, my so called "friends" at the school no longer existed upon my exit. What I would like to know though is how can the SFSK still go on being called a "school" when real schools/universities have qualified teachers/lecturers with accredited skills by specialisation?

ManOnTheStreet
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:32 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby ManOnTheStreet » Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:21 pm

Hello Sydneysider and welcome to the forum,

In regard to your question, the notion of "School" originated with the SES in London, and was appropriated by the Mavros when they set up the School of Philosophy (and later the SFSK). As far as qualifications are concerned, I think this is one of the main problems with the way the School is set up. None of the tutors are professional philosophers or even theologians. The whole teaching process is very ad hoc, and hence statements of "authority" by Mrs Mavro are given great weight (in the absence of actual critical thinking about the subject matter presented). Differing views of any kind are actively discouraged, and this strongly suggests the unwillingness (and I would say inability) of Mrs Mavro to accommodate other points of view that are, in many cases, just as valid if not more so, than the view she advocates. This was certainly my experience. Mrs Mavro herself was incapable of answering many of the questions I (and others) asked in group. She often deflects questions with "Oh, that opens up a whole area" and other such statements. Of course we never actually got around to exploring those "areas". It is hardly surprising that the other tutors are also incapable in that respect.

I agree that the organisation does not have any basis upon which to call itself a "School". It is not a place in which one is 'educated' in any meaningful way. The teachers are not qualified, the subject matter is suspect, and the structure of the place is one that centralises power in one person to the exclusion of all others.

Unfortunately, most organisations have a wide discretion with regard to what they call themselves, but ultimately, calling this organisation a "school" does not make it one.

MOTS

Sydneysider
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:47 pm

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby Sydneysider » Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:52 pm

Thank you MOTS for your welcome and your reply. Your well observed (and in my opinion correct) centralisation of power and control that existed and to my knowledge still exists at the SFSK represents complete hypocrisy to me. Right from the start during part 1 we are told that we are all equal, are an extension of one another, coming from the one source of consciousness etc. Yet there is a pyramid of "power" where one person controls every detail, from the running of workshops and similar events, to what people can do or say and at what point in time. Where is the equality there??

I myself at many times felt stifled, and all too often refrained from asking questions for fear of being told that my mind was too 'rajasic'. When the truth (like you have said MOTS) was that the tutor(s) had no idea what answer to give based on them not undertaking any formalised theological and/or philosophical study. Instead of gaining my respect by simply stating "I don't know, or I shall get back to you on that" they would resort to personal attack and deflectionary tactics. This strategy used was one that was completely unethical, and ego-centred on the tutors part.

ManOnTheStreet
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:32 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby ManOnTheStreet » Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:47 am

Yes, the tactic of "who's asking that question?" was particularly bad. This 'answer' was so ubiquitously used at School that it became a cliché. Not only does it fail to answer the question, but it makes the tutor look as if he/she has a 'deeper' understanding of the 'real' situation. All that was really happening of course was that the tutor had no idea what the answer actually was and hence engaged in a deflection. Unfortunately, the situation in School became one in which some tutors felt they had to maintain their veneer of 'superior understanding' at all costs. In fact, the situation in SFSK often reminds me of Animal Farm by George Orwell - the pigs have certainly taken over.

MOTS

Ella.M.C.
Posts: 86
Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 6:12 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby Ella.M.C. » Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:11 am

Welcome to the forums Sydneysider ..

MOTS, I totally agree with your last post .. (and most others!)
Well put, and it is something along with many other things I/we/some of us
never questioned until now..
When the view is much wider, and in a clearer perspective.

Krishna
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:04 am

Re: SFSK Devotee

Postby Krishna » Tue May 07, 2013 1:29 am

dear enlightened ,
Are you asleep and if YES WAKE up .Mr and Mrs Mavro are nothing but a bunch of ROGUES teaching The Bhagavad Geeta , they have brain washed so many people that it is their business ,don't you see it or are you wearing coloured glasses.
Wake Up Dear as the clock is ticking .
Go to HIS holiness AND LEARN THE mantra THE RIGHT WAY .'
Ask Danny ,Maria,their experience which was just DIVINE .Go for once in your Life and do the right thing and not get bullied by Mr jOHN cOOPER AND m .
tAKE CARE AND HOPE YOU FIND YOUR PEACE AND NOT GET caught in the shambles of mrs m .


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