Just discovered this! From ex pupil of Girls school

Discussion of the children's schools in the UK.
Shout
Posts: 101
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: Reality
Contact:

Postby Shout » Mon Mar 14, 2005 3:36 pm

_____________________________________________________________
Last edited by Shout on Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

daska
Posts: 270
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2005 8:29 pm
Location: UK

Postby daska » Mon Mar 14, 2005 6:27 pm

Dear Shout

Do I have to express shock? Why? This is just one more bit. In context it makes sense. I'm not condoning it I just don't feel the need to express my shock at every post.

And sorry, I thought my question was clear, but I obviously need to expand it. Were the boys told to go to a local uni? Were they told that they'd be safer at home? Were they told they'd be less of a burden? If not, why not?

For me there was a positive outcome from your post, it opened up a memory. This, for me, is something wonderful. Our problems, though they have the same root cause (at least in part) have manifested in different ways. You have overload, I have huge gaps.

Please let all the people on this forum travel their journey at their own speed.

Daska

Alban
Posts: 271
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2004 11:23 am
Location: London

Postby Alban » Mon Mar 14, 2005 8:09 pm

daska wrote:Please let all the people on this forum travel their journey at their own speed...

Daska


Absolutely...very sound advice.

We all deal with things in differet ways. I myself have travelled through resignation, humiliation, astonishment, anger, sadness, sympathy and more anger, sometimes just while reading one post.

I obviously understand your anger, Shout, but you have to look at the self-preservation angle too. Getting angry time and time again is medically proven to be bad for your health. If you end up in hospital, do you think it will make the blindest difference to them?...who suffers?

We all need to come to terms with what has happened as we will never turn back the clock. Only then can we concentrate on trying to change the present, and get acknowledgement and appologies for the past.

Alban

Shout
Posts: 101
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: Reality
Contact:

Postby Shout » Tue Mar 15, 2005 10:18 pm

_____________________________________________________________
Last edited by Shout on Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Snowman
Posts: 75
Joined: Fri Jan 28, 2005 9:31 am
Location: London

Postby Snowman » Wed Mar 16, 2005 2:59 pm

Hi Shout,

(Please read these questions with sincerity as they are meant genuinly without sarcasm or condescension)

What would you propose as an ideal course of action to achieve the aims that you have in mind?

Your aims as I understand them are to close the schools and the SES and prosecute any executive involved. Is this correct?

The campaign group SESSA is pursuing a course of action that has very clearly stated aims - if you do not agree with them could you say why?

mgormez
Posts: 501
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2003 9:33 pm
Location: Amsterdam
Contact:

Postby mgormez » Wed Mar 16, 2005 11:07 pm

Guys, please don't use those silly large fonts.
Mike Gormez

User avatar
a different guest
Posts: 620
Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2004 12:13 am
Location: Australia

Postby a different guest » Thu Mar 17, 2005 11:53 pm

mgormez wrote:Guys, please don't use those silly large fonts.


how about SENSIBLE large fonts? :angel:

mgormez
Posts: 501
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2003 9:33 pm
Location: Amsterdam
Contact:

Postby mgormez » Fri Mar 18, 2005 3:12 am

a different guest wrote:
mgormez wrote:Guys, please don't use those silly large fonts.


how about SENSIBLE large fonts? :angel:


Oh you naughty ADG.. I see where this is going and in the end you'll trick me into asking "does size really matter?"

I won't have it! :bday:


But serious, I'd think that bold would do the trick without reminding me of a nightmare some time ago which used fancy colors and large fonts.
Mike Gormez

User avatar
Keir
Posts: 177
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 5:04 am
Location: London

Postby Keir » Fri Mar 18, 2005 8:16 pm

Hello everyone,

Late for everything as always I have only seen this Board about a month ago, and due to technical difficulties it has taken me til now to post.

Reading the posts it is obvious there are people that have been affected very badly by the treatment meted out to them by one or a number of individuals. I am familiar with the sort of thing but my experiences were never as bad a some of the ones I have read here.

I heartily support an attempt to get an apology from the guilty parties, however that might be accomplished, if that will help some people. My concern is that it wont be of as much help as possibly anticipated.

The level of what comes over as hate in some posts is self destructive and is likely to remain well after any individual ex teacher has apologised via a commitee. I am sure the last thing you would want is that these emotionally disturbed ex teachers should continue to have a controlling influence on your life, let alone be making you unhealthy.

Can I respectfully suggest trying a few treatments, such as Counselling or Psychotherapy to see if they can help you move through the shame, hurt and anger. The treatments are not generally cheap but you may be able to get referred by your GP to NHS practitioners.

Given the SES's denial of the importance of emotions and feelings it is hardly surprising that the teachers at the day schools didnt have a grip on theirs. Neither did the education at St James or St Vedast equip its students to deal with the fall out from these abusive teachers. No apology will alter that, or make it any less fair that we have to pick up the tab. It comes down to a choice. Do you want to let some emotionally retarded bully continue to affect you and those around you for the rest of your life? Or do you want to move on, wiser, stronger, knowing that you have prevented another cycle of abuse from happening?

My respect goes out to all survivors of St James, St Vedast , SES, and any other abusive relationships they may find themselves in.





:infinity:

daska
Posts: 270
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2005 8:29 pm
Location: UK

Postby daska » Fri Mar 18, 2005 10:07 pm

Kier

Thank you for a very thoughtful, helpful and constructive post. And some very valid points. I agree that there are quite probably some expectations that won't be met and that some of the anger expressed here is destructive rather than constructive.

I would not condone the forcible shutting of the schools for the sole reason of mistakes in the past. But it doesn't mean that an acknowlegement won't be helpful to some.

Assuming that they do find that they were at fault and say so publicly, I very much doubt that it will make any difference to how I live my life. I very much doubt that overnight I will be able to forge beautiful and long lasting relationships. I think it likely that there will be a small part of me that grieves for the losses I have experienced as a result of the 'education' I received there for the rest of my life, in the same way that you never get over the death of someone close but only feel it less as the years go by.

But it will mean that anyone else who has the temerity to claim 'everyone was happy' will have to shut the **** up.

And that small thing would be worth a great deal.

sugarloaf
Posts: 98
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2004 11:40 am

Postby sugarloaf » Fri Mar 18, 2005 10:40 pm

Hi Keir,

Good to hear from you. As an ex classmate I remember you well (sorry to post under a pseudonym!)

Its refreshing to hear new voices and opnions here ? particularly as so many discussions end up off topic or in slanging matches?

I hope you?re well and wish you all the best

:-)

(If you want to get in touch at any point you can try PM?ing me)

User avatar
Keir
Posts: 177
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 5:04 am
Location: London

Postby Keir » Wed Mar 23, 2005 11:52 pm

Hi Daska,

Thanks for your comments. I think I read an earlier post in another forum in which you said you had had negative or diminishing feedback from your therapist.

I am sad to hear that at such an important moment you were let down by a judgemental therapist. I would none the less try some other form of therapy, even if it is by reading some of the plethora of books in the self help sections of bookshops.

I would be happy to discuss this further if you would like and maybe recommend a few books that I have found useful on my travels through this murky area, but as I think it would be off topic a private correspondence might be more appropriate.

Keir

sparks
Posts: 56
Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:17 am

Re: Just discovered this! From ex pupil of Girls school

Postby sparks » Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:26 am

Some time back
T.S wrote:We were all 11 years old?. and as a punishment made me stand in front of the class in my underwear. Having just entered puberty this was horridly humiliating. She then made all the other girls take off their dresses too. It was an age where you hadn?t got your first bra yet but were no longer flat chested - I remember other's tears. But most of all I remember the harrowing pleas of a new girl who had severe burns on her skin and had always been careful to never reveal them. She begged to not remove her dress but the teacher forced her too anyway.
T.S


And
St James pupil wrote:One SES member attempted to sexually assault me on about three occasions. He was about twenty and I was about 12/13 ??at Stanhill court he leaned over a bathroom partition and poured harpic in the bath I was about to get into.


And
clara wrote:I was molested by a builder in the toilets. Stupidly I reported the incident to ms Caldwell, (as he boasted to me of other girls he had touched up) and her response was to take me downstairs and ask him point blank. he denied it and she apologised telling him that I'd always been a liar.

My punishment was to stay in her study until I confessed to the lie. Apparently I continually flirted with male teachers and even curled my hair before school in order to get their attention (?!). Meanwhile she told me she was organising a court case in which I would have to stand up in court and tell my lie with him, his manager, his employer all speaking out against me etc etc. Eventually (three days later, no meals, no conversation - stood up in assembly whilst everyone told that I was evil and anyone caught talking to me would be punished)
Clara


Today I read some guidelines on current child protection procedures in schools. The contrast with the experiences recounted on this forum could not be starker. For example....

Children who report to a teacher (or other member of staff) that a member of education staff has abused them must be listened to and heard, whatever form their attempts to communicate their worries take. The following points give guidance on how to deal with a child who makes an allegation:
? The child should be listened to but not interviewed or asked to repeat the account. Avoid questions, particularly leading questions.
? The child should not be interrupted when recalling significant events.
? All information should be noted carefully, including details such as timing, setting, who was present and what was said, in the child?s own words. The account should be obtained verbatim or as near as possible.
? Listened to means just that; on no account should suggestions be made to children as to alternative explanations for their worries.


This is an extract from: JOINT NEOST/TEACHER UNION GUIDANCE ON EDUCATION STAFF AND CHILD PROTECTION GUIDELINES ON PRACTICE AND PROCEDURE - September 2002. The full guidelines are at http://www.lg-employers.gov.uk/document ... _abuse.doc

User avatar
Keir
Posts: 177
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 5:04 am
Location: London

Postby Keir » Fri Mar 25, 2005 6:39 am

Hi Sparks,

I dont think anyone in their right mind would condone the abusive behaviour that you extracted from posts in your reply. I do think that you do oversimplify the problem by referring to current legislation/guidance in reference to a problem that started 20 years ago. One of the reasons that the guidance is as specific as it is now is due to the bringing to light of abusive behaviour in the past, and it now makes what should be common sense to any parent or teacher unmistakable to those with apparently none.

The biggest problem with SES and the day schools was a dogma that was at its heart determined to not deal with feelings, intuition, common sense, emotional intelligence etc, and was run by an emotionally repressed individual, and staffed with a number of equally emotionally repressed individuals. At the same time it did offer parents access to a guru without having to go on a pilgramage half way round the world - which for parents that had grown up in the sixties but were now working hard to pay for their childrens education was a bonus. The day schools offered parents the idea of a return to old fashioned values of discipline and respect and a rounded education. In the context of the time these were fine aspirations that parents had for their children's education. With what more of us know now it is hard to imagine that it could have turned out any other way - along with the old fashioned values came the old fashioned problem of abusive teachers.

So, why do I bang on about all of this when I suspect you think it doesnt belong with my first sentence? Because to understand HOW it happens is to be wiser in preventing it happening again. No, it doesnt change what happened, and doesn't make it any easier for the traumatised. Maybe it does give us a way to understand how easy it is for well meaning adults to get it wrong without knowing. I think that knowing that can help in the healing that allows us all to move on. With so many books about 'how to control children' on sale to overworked emotionally underdeveloped parents today, I think the more public that the inquiry is the better. It needs to be heard.

Keir :black:

[Deleted the duplicate post - Daffy :)]

Shout
Posts: 101
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: Reality
Contact:

Better off dead

Postby Shout » Wed Jun 22, 2005 4:47 pm

_____________________________________________________________
Last edited by Shout on Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:00 pm, edited 3 times in total.


Return to “St James and St Vedast”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests